Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Boxing Skills By Charles Roy Schroeder

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by Speedbag View Post
    AugustChief,

    This page illustrates why I eventually decided to create my own system of technique names and a way to quickly (abbreviations) represent them in a method that allowed me to write specific combinations (for students practice or if I did it "by accident and wanted to remember...). And the technique names and written combinations had to allow for the fists, the elbows, the directions of movement (Elbows can hit bag in various directions), area of the bag struck, (front, back or sides) and number or rebounds inbetween each (sometimes 1,2 or 3 in the movements).

    Doc used the term "elbow-gooseneck" and "elbow-gooseneck-follow through"

    on your page 74

    The "elbow-gooseneck" motion to him was hitting with the back of the elbow (moving outward) and letting the same side fist (right elbow-right fist) follow the elbow into the bag after one rebound (from one smooth movement). This movement looks like a gooses neck (hence the name). But what does the term "back elbow-gooseneck" tell you about the direction of the elbow movment, or number of parts hitting the bag. Is there a fist in this name?.... if you did not see this book or the pictures you would not really have any idea about that, and how would you use this to write specific combinations using this and four or five other striking skills that he describes on other pages. [ His back "back elbow-gooseneck" became my Outward-Double Elbow Strike (O-DES) ]

    on page 75,

    he decribes an "elbow-gooseneck-follow through" follow by the "other fist" straight punch after after one rebound.

    So, for the Gooseneck follow-through, there was only one rebound between the elbow-fist, and now he added the other fist in after one rebound. So now you have an elbow+fist+fist with only one rebound inbetween, but the setup for this had three rebounds inbetween... so, which is the separate technique or single movement to learn, and where is the combination, or separation of "one skill" to another? He system does not really include specifics on that. [ His "back elbow-gooseneck-follow through" became my Outward-Triple Elbow Strike (O-TES) ]


    I was lucky enough to have study directly from him so I immediately understand the pictures and know how many rebounds, but I found it very problematic to use his "31 striking skills" and terminology to teach my own group, for I didn't necessary teach just 31 striking skills (these were his idea of one combination being a skill..) Doc could easily flow from one skill to the other, non-stop for 3 minutes or more, but I could not come up with an quick systematic method to write that down to include fists, elbows and number of rebounds using his terminology or system. and ... I was doing some other movements (Downward, four ways) that he did not do - and some movements (side) actually allowed for 1,2 or 3 rebounds, depending on how you want to do it. How can a comprehensive speed bag teaching system account for them?



    Unfortunately, his could not. IMO, there needed to be much more specifics to identifying individual movements (techniques) and how they are joined.

    His book describes "31 striking bag skills" and I scribbled all over mine, trying to separate and identify individual techniques from combinations and eventually created the technique names and system for writing combinations described in my book. After my own study and practice long after I left memphis, I did not see "31 striking skills" I saw 24 techniques that can create hundreds of combination possiblities, and I needed to be able to write them because the students of 'My time" demanded it. They could not remember a complicated combition using the front, side and reverse areas of the bag with fists and elbows, so I wanted to come up with a reliable way to write it for them. The incessant and constant request to come up with a method to write down complicated speed bag combinations came from my friend and speed bag student of the time, Greg Bashara, who is a jazz saxophonist. As a bag student back in the early and mid 1980's he would lecture me about creating a system to write speed bag combiations like musical notes. He used to say, mozart was a genious on the piano and organ. But if he didn't write his music down, everything he knew would die with him - and if you die I'm never gonna remember how to do these speed bag combinations or learn the ones you have taught me yet...." for him.

    but he was right. Mozart had the system of "writing music notation" that had been standardized for centuries. I did not have a time tested, standardized speed bag notation system accounting for both fists and elbows, so I set about creating it, pretty much to get Greg to shut up about it, but I also knew he was fundamentally right. There had to be a better way to teach and write speed bag skills. The result of that personal journey resulted in the system of The Speed Bag Bible.

    In his own way, Doc did the same thing, and used his own way. For the record, Some "names" of speed bag movements have changed over the years. In 1904, they describe "tatooing the bag", to which doc called "riveting" to what I call a "Front Fist Roll" (F-Roll). Same movement, just different names.

    Recently seen combinations and bag skills also have to be accounted for (phantom punches under elbows, reversing fist directions during a roll on either side of the bag...) and so it continues. Yes, I try to write every new combination I see done by others.


    Anyway, I put my pages of his book 74-75 below with my own writings on it and the way I would eventually wrote this as a practice combination in The Speed Bag Bible, page 31 ex:#4
    Thanks Alan,
    I'm always humbled the sheer breath and scope of your experiences.

    R/

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by AugustChief View Post
      Thanks Alan,
      I'm always humbled the sheer breath and scope of your experiences.

      R/
      thanks Chief. I think I lean a bit toward obsessive-compulsive, and when I get on something I like, I tend to go a bit overboard. I've had way more than a normal share of "all nighters" thinking, writing and typing about the speed bag. Sometimes it is hard to turn off. At that point a therapist would say "it's abbynormal"
      Last edited by Speedbag; 02-23-2013, 09:16 PM.
      Speed Bag

      Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
      *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
      The Quest Continues...
      Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

      THE 10th Year Reunion!

      sigpic

      The Art of the Bag

      Comment


      • #18
        ...and that was one of his short posts!

        sigpic

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Zaza View Post
          ...and that was one of his short posts!

          I'm tired tonight. Been a long week.
          Speed Bag

          Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
          *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
          The Quest Continues...
          Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

          THE 10th Year Reunion!

          sigpic

          The Art of the Bag

          Comment


          • #20
            Just took delivery on Dr. Schoeder's book. Nice library copy. IMO worth having just for the history. Plus he was a brother jarhead!
            sgt
            USMC 79-85


            Thanks to all who continue to serve... and to those that answered the call in the past!

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by bbally View Post
              Just took delivery on Dr. Schoeder's book. Nice library copy. IMO worth having just for the history. Plus he was a brother jarhead!
              And very proud of it to, I might add.
              Speed Bag

              Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
              *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
              The Quest Continues...
              Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

              THE 10th Year Reunion!

              sigpic

              The Art of the Bag

              Comment

              Speedbagforum.com is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
              Working...
              X