to fullfil the video requirement ;)

[AtTheCross]

to get my Powermill Evil Swivel

nothing special, and just like when I try to video myself flying my heli, I never do as well as when I'm off camera

[jumpcannon]

Dude thats some good baggin!

[AtTheCross]

LOL, you're being kind

Can't wait to hit my new swivel!!!

[Speedbag]

[QUOTE=jumpcannon;37133]Dude thats some good baggin![/QUOTE]

Yep, pretty solid for what he did.


ATC, You've got single and double fist pass throughs down great, along with the downward elbows. From the looks of your position and control, the side single and double punches should not give you much problem and I think you should be hitting from all around in just a few weeks.

I noticed at :05 to :08 seconds you are doing a very nice front double punch (FDP), second fist pass through to reverse single punch (RSP), then repeat.

FDP ' ' RSP ' ' FDP ' ' RSP ' ' ...repeat.


Just a thought, you can do that very same combo using the Reverse Double Punch (RDP) to Front Circle Punch (FCP)

RDP ' ' FCP ' ' RDP ' ' FCP.....

And you can connect this two combinations also. You can do the exercise below starting from either the FDP or RDP:

Double Punch ' ' single punch ' ' Double Punch ' ' Single Punch ' ' Double Punch ' ' Both fists pass thru..... Double Punch ' ' single punch ' ' Double Punch ' ' Single Punch ' ' Double Punch ' ' Both ..repeat.

or written with abbreviations, try this. (I'm starting with the Front Double Punch (FDP) but you could also start from the Reverse Double if you want.

FDP ' ' RSP ' ' FDP ' ' RSP ' ' FDP ' ' Both (to behind) RDP ' ' FCP ' ' RDP ' ' FCP ' ' RDP ' ' Both (to front, where you started)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

You can do the above by passing either the lead fist or second fist of the double punch through, written like this:


Lead Fist pass thru

L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both)...R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (Both)

Notice that the three double punchs on the same side of the bag always have the same lead and fist order L-R x3, then R-L x3 and also the same fist (lead fist) keeps passing though


Second Fist thru

L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both) ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (both)

Notice here that when the second fist of the double punch passes through it changes the natural fist order of the next double punch, AND it also alternates the fist that passes through.

Either way is correct, but passing the second fist seems to be easier for most people to learn.

in the above examples it does not matter if you start from a Front or Reverse Double Punch, it still works the same.

Hope this helps. Just do the combinations "in the air" very slow without the bag as you read them and hear the bag in your head. You already have the fist control to do these...

[AtTheCross]

A lot of things don't translate well on the internet, but with all sincerity - WHOOHOOOOO!!!! I just got analyzed by Alan!!!! THANKS!!!!

I can single and side double punch already, but that RDP ' ' FCP ' ' RDP ' ' FCP.... wasn't in my repertoire until today!! THANKS

now this: L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both)...R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (Both)

Notice that the three double punchs on the same side of the bag always have the same lead and fist order L-R x3, then R-L x3 and also the same fist (lead fist) keeps passing though

Second Fist thru

L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both) ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (both)

is going to take me a bit to get my head around, first learning the terminology then doing it!

Right now i'm practicing an inward triple elbow with no rebound on the side closest to me, i'll post a VERY slow video of me doing it and hope to get some tips on that

[Zaza]

WHOOHOOOOO!!!! I just got analyzed by Alan!!!!

...

[Speedbag]

A lot of things don't translate well on the internet, but with all sincerity - WHOOHOOOOO!!!! I just got analyzed by Alan!!!! THANKS!!!!

no problem. Truth be told I seriously love doing it, and can't shut it off if I wanted to. I really enjoy watching a bagger work and trying to figure out what they are doing. and then, if they are open to it (most are on this forum..) maybe I can offer a tip or two to make it easier or expand their skill a bit further. Especially when the video is well shot, good angle and no sound track to interfer with bag sounds. (unless you're punch drumming for real).

And analyzing Skunk, ebozyn, matthew, Tim and a "lost" member named baggist is fun to just try and figure out what they do and how they do it! They expand my mind occasionally on combinations.

I can single and side double punch already, but that RDP ' ' FCP ' ' RDP ' ' FCP.... wasn't in my repertoire until today!! THANKS

now this: L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both)...R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (Both)

Notice that the three double punchs on the same side of the bag always have the same lead and fist order L-R x3, then R-L x3 and also the same fist (lead fist) keeps passing though

Second Fist thru

L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' (Both) ' ' R-L ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (both)

is going to take me a bit to get my head around, first learning the terminology then doing it!

I hope you do spend some time on the terminology for it's really the only way to write speed bag combinations. Imagine trying to learn to play the first violin part of a great violin concerto by just watching someone play it and no sheet music. Can't be done.

As for doing it, you already have the fist control to do it. All these exercises do is reinforce the three rules of linking from any technique that uses both fists (double punches, triple elbow strikes and four way elbow strikes). you can always link the (1) lead fist, or the (2) second fist or (both fists). And - any combination with fists you can do from the front of the bag you can also do from the back. that means whatever you can off of a Front Double Punch (FDP) you can also do from a Reverse Double Punch (RDP). These combination exercises just help you learn that and connect them. But I left one out (to make it less confusing...) You can also mix these by passing the Lead fist of the double punch, followed by the second fist, and then both. Don't let that confuse you, because it sounds complicated and is a bit more difficult to do, but will really let you have a greater sense of hand control front to back. The fist order will be:

Lead fist, Second fist, both.

L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (Both) ' ' L-R ' ' L ' ' L-R ' ' R ' ' R-L ' ' (both)

Right now i'm practicing an inward triple elbow with no rebound on the side closest to me, i'll post a VERY slow video of me doing it and hope to get some tips on that

I'm having a hard time envision that one. I havent seen many combinations on the bag with "NO rebound" inbetween the parts. IF you can do that, you can might be giving me the tip on how, 'cause on my best day I can barely click off and inward ' outward elbow strike with ONE rebound inbetween and even double bumping requires one rebound.

[AtTheCross]

@Speedbag ok, this is what i'm trying to do, I didn't describe it well, I know this is nothing new

[AtTheCross]

and here is the rhythm you gave me, still have to think too much to do it, but will incorporate it in my hitting so it becomes natual

[Speedbag]

and here is the rhythm you gave me, still have to think too much to do it, but will incorporate it in my hitting so it becomes natual

Great, performed exactly as written letting the lead fist pass through from a front or reverse double punch. be sure to practice it with both hands leading. by that I mean, (for instance) you are always doing the Front Double Punch (FDP) in the L-R position and the Reverse Double Punch (RDP) in the R-L position. Try doing it with the other fist leading, meaning do the FDP in a R-L fist order, which will automatically change the fist order of the other side. You can also add a bit of difficulty () by rotating the fist order of the double punch after the double fist pass through. this sounds confusing but actually when you rotate the fists after a double fist pass you will have the same fist order on the other side of the bag.

Great Job. You can do it.

[AtTheCross]

thanks will make sure I do it with leading with other hand. I'll try and get my head around the rotating the fist thing.

so how do you write the the other video and do you have any tips for me getting that rhythm down?

[Speedbag]

thanks will make sure I do it with leading with other hand. I'll try and get my head around the rotating the fist thing.

so how do you write the the other video and do you have any tips for me getting that rhythm down?

Here it is:

@Speedbag ok, this is what i'm trying to do, I didn't describe it well, I know this is nothing new

You do this very well actually for it is a difficult combination to understand and keep going.

Like many advanced speed bag combinations, there are several ways to "envision" the combination, and several ways to write it - and none would be wrong. To me It really depends on your familiarity of the Speed Bag Bible system of Techniques, understanding and writing combinations.

Basically you have four surfaces to hit the bag, two fists and two elbows, and on the elbows you have a couple of specific contact points, ie...on the forearm front side (inward) or on the humeral back (tricep) side (outward. Downward also hits this point.)

In this combo you are hitting all four surfaces, both fists and both inward points of the elbows, and doing it all continuously with only one rebound in between. Some people might see this combo as continuous alternating out-and-In four Way Elbow Strikes (O-I 4 way) but I think that is wrong because you are never really hitting the back (tricep) surface of the elbow, and the movements when you start originates from the fists first or and Inward-Double Elbow Strike to start the combo. But that is not as important as when you keep it going for 3 or more times.

So, Basically you could say you are doing a Front Double Punch followed by an inward Single Elbow strike of the second fist.

(FDP) ' (I-SES) ' (FDP) ' (I-SES).
L-R.........R.........R-L.........L....

and the above would be correct if you see it that way,....

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

OR: as you start this usually with an Inward Double Elbow Strike (I-DES) and then re-hit with the same fist after one rebound, you could write it like this:


(I-DES) ' (FCP) ' (I-DES) ' (FCP)
..R-R........R.........L-L........L.....


and that would be correct. This is actually how you start it and do it, sort of dropping your hands as you execute it.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


OR, look at the first example. You could know that a FDP + I-SES = Inward Triple Elbow Strike (I-TES).

in that case, this combination, once it gets going after the start, can be written

(I-TES) ' (I-TES) ' .....repeating

This is actually MY personal Preference for writing this combination, for it tells me everything I need to know very quickly. Here it is below:

It is a bit difficult to envision in the pictures because you keep dropping the arms to you waist, making the movement look more like an Inward Double Elbow Strike. The position of your arms will make the untrained eye miss that you are really doing a FDP at that point, but the other fist is down very low when your inward elbow connects. Look at the pics on the right of each technique, when your elbow hits, your other arm is down at your waist. I would suggest keeping the fists up very close to the chin on this combo.

To understand the "written combination" at the far right, use this reference and look down the page to see how the arms, fists and elbows are indicated.

Hope this helps you understand.

[AtTheCross]

it does help A LOT thanks!!

[Biff]

ATC, here is video of Billy Mackk, a great bagger and long time member, doing continuous, alternating I-TES, with 1 rebound in between. This in done on a 5 X 8 bag, not an easy combo on such a small bag! Sure do miss his presence on the forum.

He does show the combo in slow motion, coming off a F-Roll.

[AtTheCross]

thanks Biff, I'm also trying to do it on a 5x8 bag, my 7x10 is too big as I can't get enough elbow strength to hit and get a good rebound. Hoping my 6x9 Balazs Lazer bag will be the ticket along with my Powermill swivel