How To Swivel question

[ncjosh02]

I just installed my new xmark speed bag platform. I bought a new swivel to put on it but it doesn't seem to be the same size as the one that originally came on the xmark platform. My question is it ok to drill new holes into the platform? I just want to make sure before i go drilling into my brand new platform. Please let me know. Thank you

[swfl]

Hello ncjosh02 and welcome. The short answer is.. Yes you can drill new holes. Through bolts are better than screws for fastening the swivel to the platform. One question ?... What type of swivel do you plan on installing? Pictures are always good to help give direction. Enjoy the ride.

[MsDeville]

Welcome, ncjosh02. Is your speed bag drum made of solid wood? If so, you can simply rotate the swivel a little and screw it in with wood screws, creating new holes. You can use 1-1/4" or 1-5/8" wood screws. I wouldn't pre-drill the holes, unless you use a smaller gauge drill than the screws. This way, you'll get a tighter fit when you screw them in.

Lag bolts can be used, but, not necessary, imo, and can be more of a hassle than simple screws. I am constantly swapping out swivels on my hardwood drum and I find that using wood screws makes it much easier than dealing with big lag bolts, etc. I even used wood screws on my custom concrete drum! I just inserted some wood doweling in the over-sized holes and it kept the screws in place.

If the drum isn't made of solid wood, you can still use the wood screws, unless it's the really cheap pressed wood (made of compressed sawdust). But, it's up to the individual…

[Speedbag]

Welcome to the forum ncjosh02

As SWFL and MsDeville point out, yes you can create new holes. I would place any new holes directly inbetween the current holes, and use bolts if possible, particularly if you plan on changing swivels occasionally. But in the long run screws will probably work fine for you if you can't use bolts.

[ncjosh02]

To speedbag

Ok thank you guys for the responses. I appreciate it. Speedbag Whats your favorite swivel? My uncle put up the title platinum swivel U hook and its ok but it doesn't seem at smooth on side punches as other videos I see of you guys hitting on youtube. Any suggestions on swivels you recommend?

[Speedbag]

Ok thank you guys for the responses. I appreciate it. Speedbag Whats your favorite swivel? My uncle put up the title platinum swivel U hook and its ok but it doesn't seem at smooth on side punches as other videos I see of you guys hitting on youtube. Any suggestions on swivels you recommend?

My favorite swivel is a Ball Hook, for the reason you state. Right now I have a Deville ball hook on my board.

[ncjosh02]

Ball hook

Yea i think im going to order a ball hook swivel. How does the deville ball hook compare to the powermill? I see alot of people use the ball hooks but some have a hook that closes completely. Then i see others just slip the bag on the hook and not have to close it. I just am worried about the ball hook that doesn't close. Does the ball hok ever stretch after hitting the bag hard time and time again? If the hook eventually stretches wont the bag continually keep falling off when u hit it hard?

[ncjosh02]

ball hook

And when you change your swivel should I take my wood drum down or can I just unscrew it while its still hanging on the wall? I have a xmark wood adjustable platform.

[ncjosh02]

ball hook

Ok thank you so much for your responses, help, and information I appreciate it and I'm sure ill be back on here asking more questions in the future as I'm semi new to this. I decided I'm going to order the Deville No.13 swivel. Then I will probly get a powermill down the road. Thanks again for yours guys help. I will load some pics of my setup sometime

[PunchDrummer]

You won't regret the Deville swivel.
I'm older and have been experimenting with swivels on-and-off for over 40 years. Not nearly as skillful as Alan or some of the others (yet) because there have been gaps (of decades) between practice and I didn't know what I was doing until only recently when I was fortunate to find Master teacher/performer Alan Kahn to show me how to punch properly on his DVD.

The Deville uses a very slippery but durable neoprene base, and the highly polished and heavy brass ball quietly does it's job like a big old Cadillac, glued to the highway, gliding over the terrain. It's quieter than a metal-on-metal ball-hook, and so far, just as durable. It is the showpiece on the platform in my living room, but outside I like to experiment with various metal swivels (Chain-Link, U-Bolt, and other Ball-hook swivels). For outside swivels, it's nice if they are removable (unscrew from the base) to protect them from the weather. Unfortunately, most consumer-grade swivels are not machined as precisely as they used to be, and, the Powermill is made with care for the people here on the forum. It's a little noisier (metal-on-metal), but it's a high-quality product, albeit difficult to get due to limited supply.

I personally recommend starting off and "suffering" with (not really - it's all education, it's all good) a chain-link or U-bolt, and then giving yourself the gift of a Deville. You'll have earned the privilege and will better-appreciate the joy of truly understanding what Dee has created for you with the Deville line of cream-of-the crop swivels.
And no - you don't have to remove the drum to change swivels. Take your time, protect your eyes, drill straight pilot holes, and you should be able to manage the four screws without losing any or straining your neck too badly. Keep your mouth closed as you're staring up at the screws - otherwise you may exceed your daily allowance of iron, chromium, stainless steel, or whatever your screws are made of.

The more experience you have, the less of an issue you will have with the bag flying off the swivel. The rubber cap supplied with my Deville is adequate to keep the bags from flying off. The trick is to adjust the cap after you put the bag on, to leave less of a gap.

OK - Have fun!

[MsDeville]

Thanks for the glowing description of the 13, Punch Drummer. I have to admit, the white No.13 looks GREAT on your ebony drum.

I concur regarding the recommendation to start out on the u-bolt or chain link. After all, once you go ball-hook, you'll never want to use any other style of swivel and I think it's kind of a rite of passage to start out on those other swivels. I did. But, once I switched to a ball-hook…well… I was HOOKED after the first hour on it.

When you get the 13 (it's on its way), just remember to keep the elbows up and strike evenly and rhythmically. Have patience. Your next purchase should probably be the Speed Bag Bible.


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[Thor]

I didn't know what I was doing until only recently when I was fortunate to find Master teacher/performer Alan Kahn to show me how to punch properly on his DVD.

Alan has a DVD too?

But, once I switched to a ball-hook…well… I was HOOKED after the first hour on it.

I've been punching the ball hook now for two days and it's frustrating as hell. I can see that it's about the smoothest and most organic swivel design there is - but man, I feel like a second-grader trying to control it. I'm still like 15 seconds of a triplet rhythm at decent speed before the bag goes into "orbit".

You really wouldn't think there'd be that much difference. The chain-link I started on and used for a month articulated in basically all directions - or so it looked to me. I could keep that one going indefinitely. But the ball-hook is playing with my head.

I'm ain't quittin' it though.

[MsDeville]

Alan has a DVD too?



I've been punching the ball hook now for two days and it's frustrating as hell. I can see that it's about the smoothest and most organic swivel design there is - but man, I feel like a second-grader trying to control it. I'm still like 15 seconds of a triplet rhythm at decent speed before the bag goes into "orbit".

You really wouldn't think there'd be that much difference. The chain-link I started on and used for a month articulated in basically all directions - or so it looked to me. I could keep that one going indefinitely. But the ball-hook is playing with my head.

I'm ain't quittin' it though.

I know there are a lot of other baggers out there who can relate, Thor! A ball-hook really makes you stop and assess what you're doing. Your stance in relationship to the bag, how you're holding your arms, and how consistent you are in repeating each punch with the same direction and power.

Have you tried using a different bag? I think it's really helpful to start out on a larger bag because you'll have a little more control of it. Sometimes putting a little less air in the bag will keep it from going all whacky. Try videotaping yourself and watch it to see what you might be doing wrong without realizing it. Maybe you're leading more with your right or dropping your elbows. I know Alan can give you more pointers, especially if you can post a video.

[Speedbag]

Alan has a DVD too?

Yes there is a video. As a forum member you can get it for less via the PM contact messaging. click on "contact info" and "send a private message".

I've been punching the ball hook now for two days and it's frustrating as hell. I can see that it's about the smoothest and most organic swivel design there is - but man, I feel like a second-grader trying to control it. I'm still like 15 seconds of a triplet rhythm at decent speed before the bag goes into "orbit".

You really wouldn't think there'd be that much difference. The chain-link I started on and used for a month articulated in basically all directions - or so it looked to me. I could keep that one going indefinitely. But the ball-hook is playing with my head.

I'm ain't quittin' it though.

It is hard for me to imagine a real difference between swivels for I started on ballhook and chainlink swivels. I did find the plastic ballhook difficult to control when it first came out - which seemed to do a lot of "floating" and helicoptering initially. took a while to figure it out and I finally determined that I suck on it.

I would suggest you back off "the decent speed" and go slower to emphasize control. I suspect you might be trying to go a bit too fast on it for you control and your punch hits a bit late in the rebound, off from the exact contact point causing it to go offline. The answer to that is slow down a bit. Speed will come without trying to go fast.

[Thor]

Have you tried using a different bag? I think it's really helpful to start out on a larger bag because you'll have a little more control of it. Sometimes putting a little less air in the bag will keep it from going all whacky.

Yeah ... bigger bag - I have one ordered, hope it's big enough. I actually did read Alan's advice to start on a bigger bag - but I'm like ... "Psshaw! I can handle a small bag!" Especially since the bag I started on (on the chain swivel) was a "small" bag (or so i thought - until I actually ordered a small bag and saw how tiny it was!).

I suspect you might be trying to go a bit too fast on it for you control and your punch hits a bit late in the rebound, off from the exact contact point causing it to go offline. The answer to that is slow down a bit. Speed will come without trying to go fast.

YES!! On the chain swivel I felt what a "good" hit felt like and it does seem to me I'm hitting it late. Imma work on that.

DVD ordered - I just bought it off Amazon - there are only two left now folks! :P