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Separate ways on the bag

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  • Separate ways on the bag

    Last edited by Tim; 07-22-2019, 07:54 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Davidlwilkie View Post
    Good stuff. Makes it look so easy. I struggle to get my elbows in there.

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    • #3
      Amazing fluidity, wow! 👍🏼

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Davidlwilkie View Post
        Good set. You're finding the groove.

        Fun, isn't it.!




        A few years ago...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB10mdF6d4Q

        Speed Bag

        Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
        *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
        The Quest Continues...
        Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

        THE 10th Year Reunion!

        sigpic

        The Art of the Bag

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        • #5
          Yes it's a blast. I go too hard sometimes but can't help myself. I wish I had some musical talent so I could get the groove faster but I'll get there. Thanks for all your help.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Davidlwilkie View Post
            Yes it's a blast. I go too hard sometimes but can't help myself. I wish I had some musical talent so I could get the groove faster but I'll get there. Thanks for all your help.
            The key to punch drumming (IMO) is to sync the bag beat to the (1) Msin Song beat and best yet, to the (2) beat pattern of a particular melody or a (3) beat riff in the song.

            Of course the (1) over all main song beat is the key. Everything comes off that. not every song offers (2) a melody beat pattern that perfectly syncs to a bag beat combination, but when it does it will still be in time with #1. It's easier (to me) to find quick "beat riffs (3) in a song, that some combinations will perfectly match, but again they will be in time with #1.

            As for "going to hard", Yeah, I get that. The urge to "go faster in a song", usually to a bag speed beat that is slightly off the to the song. You can go hard to "double time" and sync perfectly, but that is tough on a pretty fast song already. When I see most baggers try it to force fancier to more complicated speed bag combinations, for fun or skill test, just to do them..but the beat pattern of the combo does NOT fit the song or is off, depending on where it begins in the measure. Every combination no matter how back or fancy has a "beat pattern" of accented and unaccented rebounds. Every one can "usually" be synced to a #1 Main song beat IF you can (a) go as fast as the song beat demands to match the beat,....AND (2) feel what part/beat of the measure is the best place to start it. That can make a lot of difference if the combo sound "really in sync" to the song beat, or if it ends up being a "fancy speed bag combination" done with music in the background, not necessarily on beat (to the music). I see/hear this a lot with the phantom punch combinations and fancy elbow strikes. Baggers love to do them, AND do them to music because "baggers gotta bag" but they end up being off beat and "out of sync" to the song because they are either "Too fast or slow" to the song, as well as being started when the bagger feels like it, and not when the music allows it. ie...started in the wrong beat of a measure. Then you're "going to hard" for a speed bag combo, and not drumming to the song.

            In truth, IF you honest, you will see most Punch Drumming video's have the bag "off beat" at least 25% of the time, and the bag will eventually sync to the bag beat for a short time. Personally I figure half of the baggers sync it on purpose and the other half are lucky, because song and bag will eventually match occasionally, but I can often tell it's doesn't happen on purpose, or the bagger hasn't yet figured out how to get in and out of beat patterns in a way that matches the song. It's all part of the learning process and when you learn to "under bag" a song more than "over bag" it, most will be more successful in creating pure punch drumming. I'm sure that is not everyone's opinion, and of course there is no "wrong way" to hit to music if someone enjoys it that way.

            +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

            As for YOU specifically, You're punch drumming has really improved over time, IMO. You've always been "ON" beat more than not and you use to "go hard" ie...force some complicated/cool speed bag combo's who's accent pattern don't necessarily fit that song beat a little more in earlier video's. I think you are getting more control of "bag beat" and the combinations that make them. Also helps to get more control from around the bag, to start a sound pattern you hear in your head from any area around the bag.

            And Yes I do analyze videos of punch drumming to see great grooves as well as off ones. Here's my real take on your Separate Ways.

            0-:20 started off in nice basic punching (straight time punching) up until 20 seconds, then started a bit faster syncopated punching combinations. Nice transition. However, I notice you stayed in the faster Syncopated combinations for the rest of the song. Me personally (just my style) I like to go between these occasionally, when certain areas of the song allow it, AND because the basic punching is less intensive, can grab a few second rest on shoulders, and then emphasize the speed up to synco during a more intense song riff (especially drum in background). This is a LONG song, and I can tell you were a bit burned at the end. You could grab some rest by slowing down to basic punching for a few measures along they way. (note: when I was younger with better shoulders and stamina, I tended to burn through songs, at mock speed also. I guess its a macho bagger thing, but my older self likes the rests occasionally. shoulders do also. )

            1:15 to 1:29... Nice mix of Front Double Punching (FDP), keeping the Second fist of the FDP and Reverse Double Punch (RDP) on the beat.

            1:30: when voice say "SEPARATE WAYS..." that quick phantom combo that starts on "Ways " is Brilliant! dead on beat, looks great. A quick 6-beat phantom. Brilliant in and out.... I really like that one!

            1:37 downward triples were dead on. NICE combo...

            at 1:42 you try same combo as 1:30 and beat didn't match as much (to me)

            1:49- 1:52, nice mix of Reverse Single Punching (RSP)

            2:08 - 2:15 Nice punching combo's. dead on beat mixing single and double fist linking.

            2:17 - 2:29 a little over punching maybe.... more off beat then on to my ears. Of course the flow is nice, but to me the bag beat is a bit off. This could also be affect up uploading. sometimes I notice the youtube video picture and sound is a bit off.

            3:28 - 3:39 awesome mix.

            Any way. Hope that is useful. I did not see many Front First Rolls over 3 or 4 punches, or split fists. Remember you can get the same sound from a Front-Back split fist as a single fist past through yet totally different look (for show) and can also front-back split fist on four rebounds from emphasis. (have to hit the bag a bit hard to 4 rebounds on beat instead of 3, so the punch sounds accented.) Can also use Hook Punches for that.

            But I'm really happy with your progress. You are starting to really own the bag beat.


            Keep Punching!
            Speed Bag

            Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
            *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
            The Quest Continues...
            Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

            THE 10th Year Reunion!

            sigpic

            The Art of the Bag

            Comment


            • #7
              Thanks for the advice I'm going to have to re watch it and try to clean it up a little.

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