Speed Bagging is "Too Legit to Quit"

[novaspeedbagger]

Thanks Juxt and Dee! I'm ready for your next posts

now thats what i call funky! Nice linking combos, with some elbows thrown in. the bag sounded good over the beat too.

Thanks for viewing the vid and the comments juxt! I'm gonna drop in and check out your clips! Keep it baggin!

An excellent breakdown of nova's clip, Tim.

I've watched this clip several times. It's great! Or, to use a term from my youngest son, "WORD."

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=word

So glad you've joined the ranks of fellow punch-drummers... you definitely have the gift, Kerry. You're inspirational, for sure. (Your students are lucky to have such a terrific teacher!) Your videos are great! Keep 'em comin'.

Thanks again Dee! You ready for Sympathy for the devil yet? Coming soon

[Speedbag]

Thanks for viewing the vid and the comments juxt! I'm gonna drop in and check out your clips! Keep it baggin!



Thanks again Dee! You ready for Sympathy for the devil yet? Coming soon

Sympathy for the Devil is not a real fast song and lends itself for punching in three variations. First a slow basic rhythm pattern or second, a very fast basic rhythm pattern (actually a double time beat), or third the syncopated combinations inbetween. The sncopated combinations will fit nicely (not too fast) on an 8x5. ( 8x5 or 7x4 will make the double time variations a bit easier). You should be able to jump to all three punching variations comfortably with an 8x5.

Just my take on Punch Drumming to SFTD.

[jumpcannon]

Punchdrumming seems like it can be really technical. Trying to figure out the basic punching rhythm and what combos to hit within the song. I have never tried it because my plate is already full when it comes to learning the bag. But i always hit with music playing in the background.

[novaspeedbagger]

Sympathy for the Devil is not a real fast song and lends itself for punching in three variations. First a slow basic rhythm pattern or second, a very fast basic rhythm pattern (actually a double time beat), or third the syncopated combinations inbetween. The sncopated combinations will fit nicely (not too fast) on an 8x5. ( 8x5 or 7x4 will make the double time variations a bit easier). You should be able to jump to all three punching variations comfortably with an 8x5.

Just my take on Punch Drumming to SFTD.

I'm not sure if I understand (syncopated combinations) unless I am doing that sometimes without realizing it. But I'll try the slow basic and fast basic for sure. The 3rd I'll attempt and see how it goes.

Thanks AK

[Speedbag]

I'm not sure if I understand (syncopated combinations) unless I am doing that sometimes without realizing it. But I'll try the slow basic and fast basic for sure. The 3rd I'll attempt and see how it goes.

Thanks AK

Nova,

When I say "Syncopated combinations" I mean certain 2,3 or 4 speed bag techniques done together (that makes them a combination...) that have one or more punches within the combo that will always fall ON one of the main beats within the measure of the music. All you have to do is adjust your punching speed to make that punch or punches within the combination land on the beat of music. When you hear it, you will notice the bag beats are right on with the music, and you will notice that it is repetitive since you will normally do the same combination two or more times.

As I hit to music I notice that several "repetitive combinations" would fit great to music if I adjusted my punching speed to match up the accents (accents when hitting to music are the main punch bag beat. with double or triple part techniques it will be the LAST contact....ie, second fist of a double punch). The combinations themselves are not hard, especially if you can link front to back with either or both fists, starting from either side of the bag.

You can sample and explanations in The Speed Bag Bible, Pages 169 -172.

Here are a few. Underlined technique lands ON a main beat of measure. these will work for ANY 4/4 based music.

5-1_ A six punch combo: Five punches from one side in triplet rhythm. one punch from the other side.
FCP ' ' ' FSP ' ' ' FCP ' ' ' FSP ' ' ' FCP ' ' RSP ' '...repeat.

3-3_ A six Punch Combo. Three punches from one side, three punches from the other.
FCP ' ' ' FCP ' ' ' FCP ' ' RSP ' ' ' RSP ' ' ' RSP ' '... repeat.

Single Fist pass thru to Double Punch, three rebounds, repeat.
(FSP) ' ' (RSP) ' ' (FDP) ' ' ' ...... (* this combo starts inbetween two main beats, like "1-and", not on a main beat).

Front Double Punch, RSPx2: (FDP) ' ' (RSP) ' ' (RSP) ' ' ...repeat

...there are numberous others. Here are a few samples I have online:

Tribal Dance: I explain the 6 beat theme of the song and how the 5-1 fits perfectly. But other syncopated combo's can be seen in the song. You have to watch to see the syncopated combo's itself, as separate from other punches that are improvised to keep the beat going. Don't overthink it. Just listen to the bag beat and notice that repetitive syncopated combo that makes it.

Open: 5-1
2:03 - 2:10 notice 3-3, 3-3, 5-1(from behind bag)

2:30 - 2:43 straight time punching ON the beat (4 punches per 4 beats of music, not six punches for 4 beats).

2:52 - notice I start from a dead bag: 3-3, 5-1x3,
3:01 notice FCP ' ' RSP ' ' FDP ' ' ' x3

Do I think about these consciously when hitting?? NO. I grooving to the song, but these combo's just seem to come up a lot. Actually, I wouldn't even have noticed accept for looking for a method to teach how to do it.

Also watch for those combination in Pendulum. notice I open with straight time punching, then switch to syncopated combo's at :57 seconds (5-1 open) and go off from there. (* I changed there because the singer says .."combination style" which is cool when the song words fit the bag.) Look for the above combinations to occur as I punch. Actually review most of my music video's and you will see them. They work and I use them a lot.

when going from straight time punching to syncopated punching combinations you will have to change punching speed, and if you punch faster or slower depends on the song speed. On this song (Pendulum) I could easily go faster to find the correct to make the bag beats sync to the music.

Anyway, hope it helps. YOU and many other baggers certainly have the speed bag punching skills to do these combinations. Actually you already are, just play them. You can do it.

[Speedbag]

Punchdrumming seems like it can be really technical. Trying to figure out the basic punching rhythm and what combos to hit within the song. I have never tried it because my plate is already full when it comes to learning the bag. But i always hit with music playing in the background.

Hey JC, yes and no. The only thing "technical" is explaining how the accented bag sounds can be synced to the beat of music. Every musical INSTRUMENT (saxophone, piano, drums, flute) can be very technical to learn the basics of how the instrument works and then depends on the musician to learn it, and be able to bend it to his/her will. The better the musician, the more they can push the instrument to it's limit, until they can improvise on it, play at will, without sheet music to guide them.

Next, the language of written music can be VERY technical for the composer (beethovan, etc) needed ways to express the note, length of note, force and loudness of note, and emotion of note(s) to be play. Hearing the conductor explain to the first violin section how "this movement" or stanza or section is to be played can be extremely technical. And every musician there has paid their practice dues on the instrument to understand and handle that technicality. That is learned in the thousands of hours of practice and studying music. Then when it comes times for performance, - it all comes togehter. The audience is moved by the hour performance they heard, never hearing the thousands of hours it took to make that performance happen.

And so it is with the speed bag and punch drumming. Our instrument is the speed bag, and its music is the bag beat of the rebound. No sharps or Flats to worry about, just the accented (punched) and unaccented (swinging rebound) sounds of the rebounds. When you learn the bag skills, technique by technique, combination to combination, you will start to recognize the "bag beat" and then begin to control it. Eventually you will learn to bend it to your will, faster or slower, making double beats or triple beats when you want them. By that point you will understand how it all works. Unfortunately, the only sheet music for this is the abbreviated system for speed bag punching that I created - and did that largely for this reason. To have a reasonably consistent way to write down the notes of the instrument. There is not one combination I do that I can not write. Yes, I could write out a written punching sheet (orchestral drum part) for a song, but I never do. Personally I improvise most of my punch drumming. And you already have the punching skills to do it. Bag wise YOU can do this with only the basic rhythm. The more notes (techniques) you learn on the instrument (speed bag) the more you will be able to play.

Don't fear the "technicality". It will soon be childs play on your bag.

[jumpcannon]

Wow...You really explained that well!

[novaspeedbagger]

Thanks Alan for taking the time to post this advice! I check out pendulum and it did help me to understand what you mean by syncopated. I taking it to the drum to try it out!

[Speedbag]

Thanks Alan for taking the time to post this advice! I check out pendulum and it did help me to understand what you mean by syncopated. I taking it to the drum to try it out!

Nova, Once your "ear" gets it, you are gonna rock the punchdrumming world, brother. You already have the punching skills to do all of the syncopated combinations with no problem. Then hang on, 'cause your gonna be jammin' non-stop.

[fingers]

Alan what a great explanation!! i was touched! reminded me of the countless hours-years i spent learning Blues harp (harmonica) all by ear and ended up playing semi-pro for over 12 years! some of the best times of my life perhaps i should give this punch drumming a try hope my post doesn't sound too flash

[Speedbag]

Alan what a great explanation!! i was touched! reminded me of the countless hours-years i spent learning Blues harp (harmonica) all by ear and ended up playing semi-pro for over 12 years! some of the best times of my life perhaps i should give this punch drumming a try hope my post doesn't sound too flash

Fingers, man if you are jammin' on Blues Harp I know you have the ear for Punch Drumming. One secret to punch drumming is "knowing where you are in the measure" and NOT having to think about it. A lot of the bag beats and combinations are syncing to the "1" beat (down beat) and "3" beat of a measure. Many also have punches hit on the "back beat" or at the "Half" point, between two main beats. (linking a single fist does this automatically. If the front fist hits on "1" the reverse punch hits on "1 and.."

But you really can't think about it when you doing it, - you have to feel it, and if your jammin' blues harp I know you can feel it and know where you are in the measure. And you know that a lot of songs have 8, 16 bar melody riffs, so you also know where the melody or bridge is going. That makes it easier.

YOU CAN DO THIS! Give a try and make yourself smile!

[novaspeedbagger]

Blues Baggin! The Thrill ain't Gone

Fingers, man if you are jammin' on Blues Harp I know you have the ear for Punch Drumming. One secret to punch drumming is "knowing where you are in the measure" [U]and NOT having to think about it

YOU CAN DO THIS! Give a try and make yourself smile!

I recommend AK's advice highly fingers! More and more since I've been hitting to music, I just let my playlist run and freestyle to any type of music. I'm discovering that my ability to find the beat in a song and then instinctively punching out a natural combination is getting to be more second nature and not mechanical. It's doin what Alan Advises on his book cover, "Put a little Rhythm is your workout".

With that Blues background of yours, you may become the next BB King of speedbaggin! Or, better yet SB King!

I'm gonna have to try some Blues Baggin myself!

Gonna have to download some BB King today!

Thanks for postin and planting a great idea in our brains!

[Speedbag]

I just let my playlist run and freestyle to any type of music. I'm discovering that my ability to find the beat in a song and then instinctively punching out a natural combination is getting to be more second nature and not mechanical.

Funny how that works, ain't it.??

Hand dancing on the speed bag. Oh yea. Throw up a little Billy Idol "Dancing with Myself" and let 'er rip. (Straight time punching pretty easy. Get a small bag for syncopated rhythms...)

With that Blues background of yours, you may become the next BB King of speedbaggin! Or, better yet SB King!

I'm gonna have to try some Blues Baggin myself!

Gonna have to download some BB King today!

Thanks for postin and planting a great idea in our brains!

The BB King of Baggin'. I like it! Kinda Rolls off the Tongue, Don't it??

[fingers]

AK / Nova!! thanks for the advice and encouragement i think i will make this my next mission.......Blues baggin!! watch this space.

[MsDeville]

Hey JC, yes and no. The only thing "technical" is explaining how the accented bag sounds can be synced to the beat of music. Every musical INSTRUMENT (saxophone, piano, drums, flute) can be very technical to learn the basics of how the instrument works and then depends on the musician to learn it, and be able to bend it to his/her will. The better the musician, the more they can push the instrument to it's limit, until they can improvise on it, play at will, without sheet music to guide them.

Next, the language of written music can be VERY technical for the composer (beethovan, etc) needed ways to express the note, length of note, force and loudness of note, and emotion of note(s) to be play. Hearing the conductor explain to the first violin section how "this movement" or stanza or section is to be played can be extremely technical. And every musician there has paid their practice dues on the instrument to understand and handle that technicality. That is learned in the thousands of hours of practice and studying music. Then when it comes times for performance, - it all comes togehter. The audience is moved by the hour performance they heard, never hearing the thousands of hours it took to make that performance happen.

And so it is with the speed bag and punch drumming. Our instrument is the speed bag, and its music is the bag beat of the rebound. No sharps or Flats to worry about, just the accented (punched) and unaccented (swinging rebound) sounds of the rebounds. When you learn the bag skills, technique by technique, combination to combination, you will start to recognize the "bag beat" and then begin to control it. Eventually you will learn to bend it to your will, faster or slower, making double beats or triple beats when you want them. By that point you will understand how it all works. Unfortunately, the only sheet music for this is the abbreviated system for speed bag punching that I created - and did that largely for this reason. To have a reasonably consistent way to write down the notes of the instrument. There is not one combination I do that I can not write. Yes, I could write out a written punching sheet (orchestral drum part) for a song, but I never do. Personally I improvise most of my punch drumming. And you already have the punching skills to do it. Bag wise YOU can do this with only the basic rhythm. The more notes (techniques) you learn on the instrument (speed bag) the more you will be able to play.

Don't fear the "technicality". It will soon be childs play on your bag.

Alan, this was so profound for me. This thread says so much about the art of "playing the bag." And you explained it so well. You are definitely our Guru here on the board. I'm still such a novice, and I seem to have a hard time grasping the "technicalities" of speed bagging.

But, I guess I'm not letting it get in the way of "playing" the bag anyway. At this (early) stage of my bagging, I have some favorite punches and combinations, and when I turn my music on, I just GO. It doesn't necessarily have to have a heavy drum beat or anything (my music choices are eclectic, as my videos can attest to that! )... but I do know this... I have to feel the music. And, I have to be comfortable enough to execute whatever punch comes to me – sometimes just a split second before I hit the bag – you just ... know what's right at that moment. Well, that's my take on it...

Nova, Once your "ear" gets it, you are gonna rock the punchdrumming world, brother. You already have the punching skills to do all of the syncopated combinations with no problem. Then hang on, 'cause your gonna be jammin' non-stop.

Boy, that's for sure!

Alan what a great explanation!! i was touched! reminded me of the countless hours-years i spent learning Blues harp (harmonica) all by ear and ended up playing semi-pro for over 12 years! some of the best times of my life perhaps i should give this punch drumming a try hope my post doesn't sound too flash

Fingers, man if you are jammin' on Blues Harp I know you have the ear for Punch Drumming. One secret to punch drumming is "knowing where you are in the measure" and NOT having to think about it. A lot of the bag beats and combinations are syncing to the "1" beat (down beat) and "3" beat of a measure. Many also have punches hit on the "back beat" or at the "Half" point, between two main beats. (linking a single fist does this automatically. If the front fist hits on "1" the reverse punch hits on "1 and.."

But you really can't think about it when you doing it, - you have to feel it, and if your jammin' blues harp I know you can feel it and know where you are in the measure. And you know that a lot of songs have 8, 16 bar melody riffs, so you also know where the melody or bridge is going. That makes it easier.

YOU CAN DO THIS! Give a try and make yourself smile!

fingers! Seriously?! You played semi-PROFESSIONAL blues harmonica?! Soooo cool. I was recently told that the harmonica is a very hard instrument to master. And it's a funny coincidence that someone just left a comment on one of my speed bag videos... I checked out his channel and he has posted several short clips of himself playing the harmonica...while traveling throughout Europe (I think he's Belgian). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2PMjsIbYzU

I would love to hear you play on your blues harp!! Any chance of you posting something online for us, perhaps?