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  • Stuck in a rut

    I need some help here. It just feels like I have leveled off with the speed bag. It feels like I am not getting better or learning anything new. I bought a new bag and that helped for a couple of days, then I built a new platform..... How do you guys get through these patches?
    Dax

  • #2
    What always works for me is to pick some technique I can't do and focus on that...

    For example, if you can do F-ROLL (Front roll) , but not R-ROLL (rear roll) try that instead.

    Or side punches, elbows (downward, outward, or inward), etc.

    I pick a technique and concentrate on it.. once I can do it well by itself then I practice transitioning to it from other techniques.

    Right now I am concentrating on advanced F-ROLL and fist rotation (from tape 4 of the Speed Bag Bible video DVD series)

    If you don't have the speed bag bible book or DVD, check out some of these video clips (from Speed Bag Central) to give you some ideas. This is by no means a comprehensive list of all the techiques, I like these clips because they are short and to the point and demonstrate one or two techniques....

    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=1&id=4&p=1 (Front Fist Roll)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=1&id=5&p=1 (Double Fist Linking)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=16&p=1 (Single fist linking Pass through)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=17&p=1 (Split Fist)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=18&p=1 (Downward Triple ES to Reverse Single Punch)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=53&p=1 (Outward and Downward Double Elbow Strikes)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=54&p=1 (Outward Triple Elbow Strike)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=55&p=1 (Reverse Fist Rolling)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=56&p=1 (Front to Reverse Fist Rolling)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=57&p=1 (Triplet Rythm)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=58&p=1 (Basic Rythm)
    http://www.speedbagcentral.com/vidpop.php?c=8&id=59&p=1 (Front Double Punch)


    Or post some video of what you can do ... we will gladly tell you where you can improve, or where to take it next....
    Last edited by Tim; 03-11-2008, 07:58 PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Great advice Tim, My problems are with transitions from one to another but they are comming slowly but surely...hehehe. Hopefully I'll be able to post a video soon we are trying to figure out how to get video clips from my daughters phone to a computer so I can post them.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by dax_q View Post
        I need some help here. It just feels like I have leveled off with the speed bag. It feels like I am not getting better or learning anything new. I bought a new bag and that helped for a couple of days, then I built a new platform..... How do you guys get through these patches?
        Dax
        I have had many "dry spells", where I'd hit and seem to do the same thing over and over, and it might get routine for a few weeks. Then, I'd have that "Eureka" workout where something new would hit me, (usually because of a miss or screw up, and something different would come from it). In those workouts, I would usually find three or four new things (new combinations or insights into how to modify something to advance a movement). When that happens I usually write them down in my own speed bag shorthand combination system, and work on them in future workouts.

        I really started breaking new ground when I started doing what I call "echo rhythms", meaning creating a 3-8 punch combination "beat sound" and then try to reproduce that beat from all positions around the bag.
        An easy way to envision that is: Front Double Punching (FDP) in the triplet rhythms creates a certain beat sound. Now reproduce it with different techniques from all around the bag. You can do that with Outward-Double Elbow Strikes (O-DES), Downward-Double Elbow Strikes (D-DES) and Reverse Double Punching (RDP). Those combinations will "echo" or reproduce the same beat. This helps you learn to control the SOUND of your punching, which really helps when punch drumming to music, where you want to reproduce beats around the bag in time to music.
        There are Tons of combinations sounds the echo each other. A three Punch Fist Roll makes the same sound as the Triple Elbow Strike. I would work on several complicated echo's (complicated because each combo includes fists linking all around the bag - using all five Double Punches.

        Front Double Punch (FDP)
        Reverse Double Punch (RDP)
        Side Double Punch (SDP)
        Reverse-Side Double Punch (R-SDP)
        Side-Reverse Double Punch (S-RDP) (*hardest to do)

        Another thing to do is: Cadence Punching. This is easier to imagine if you are a drummer or have seen a marching band and marching cadences. Think of some simple drum cadences in your head and try to punch them on the bag. Start slowly and try to figure how to replicate the accented beat sounds as close as you can.

        Another thing you could do is work on controlling new techniques that you're not very good at. Try mixing every technique with every other technique you now how to do. Even if you only know 4 or 5 of the 24 techniques, you can create tons of combinations in different orders.

        OR - you could try to punch to music. Maybe you won't get better each time, but at least your listening to your favorite tunes along the way.
        Speed Bag

        Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
        *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
        The Quest Continues...
        Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

        THE 10th Year Reunion!

        sigpic

        The Art of the Bag

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by toolboxdiver View Post
          Great advice Tim, My problems are with transitions from one to another
          Depending on what your transitioning FROM and TO, you could reverse them. For instance, If you are having trouble going from Front Double Punch (FDP) To Reverse Double Punch (RDP) - then reverse it and go from Reverse Double Punch (RDP) to Front Double Punch (FDP). It's the same movement plane, but sometimes makes it easier. Particularly when changing sides of the bag.
          Speed Bag

          Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
          *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
          The Quest Continues...
          Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

          THE 10th Year Reunion!

          sigpic

          The Art of the Bag

          Comment


          • #6
            Due to a bad right shoulder, I have to stick with the basic hits; nothing fancy.

            Still, my attitude is that I'm so thankful to be able to hit the bags. I'm not saying you're not, but like so many things in life, is just the appreciation of the moment.

            Like Speedbag said, I play music too to make hitting more than just exercise; it's an "escape".

            Plus I hit various size bags in various ways. My favorite is the double-end bags but I love the beat of the speed bags though.

            It's good to search for new over known, but it's also good to have a new look at what is known.

            Comment


            • #7
              Thanks for all the responses. Tim, here is a link of me messing around tonight
              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yv61hU8KDT0
              -Dax

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by dax_q View Post
                Thanks for all the responses. Tim, here is a link of me messing around tonight
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yv61hU8KDT0
                -Dax
                For some reason, everytime I go to youtube, it shows the video name and sound, but no video. I've got three computers in my house and each one is the same! I cannot get a video picture.

                ??? When I can get a video to play, I'll check it out.
                Speed Bag

                Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
                *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
                The Quest Continues...
                Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

                THE 10th Year Reunion!

                sigpic

                The Art of the Bag

                Comment


                • #9
                  Same problem here. Apparently You Tube has changed some things, and you have to download an upgraded flash player in order to see anything.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I was able to view it no problems... but I'm on Mac so that may have something to do with it.

                    You've got a really impressive command of many of the speed bag bible techniques. Do you have the speed bag bible, either book or DVD ?

                    You've got linking down well , front fist roll, great downward elbows, front double punch, some side punch all done very well.

                    Here's a few directions you could head in next

                    Reverse Fist Roll

                    I saw downard elbows, but no outwards, no inwards. You can also combine those into various 3 way (outward triple elbow for example) and 4 way elbows (either out and in or out and down)



                    Oh and good choice on the movie, Dumb and Dumber is one of my all time favorites
                    Last edited by Tim; 03-12-2008, 06:01 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by dax_q View Post
                      Thanks for all the responses. Tim, here is a link of me messing around tonight
                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yv61hU8KDT0

                      -Dax
                      OK, I finally saw it. Very nice work, with Nice rhythm and speed. I would suggest you keep the elbows up when doing linking, particularly the Side Double Punching (SDP) Sequence starting at 46 seconds. Notice how your Right fist leads the Reverse Double Punch (RDP), then comes to the front and should go out to the side. But you really drop you right Elbow to your waist, then you drop the left, and then try to fling your fists into the Side of the bag for the SDP with both elbows low, like a windshield wiper. You missed almost every time. Your low elbow position will make your fists travel in an "arc" upward and downward, making it very difficult to maintain a consistent contact point on either side of the bag. I suggest you keep the elbows up during the entire sequence, which will keep your fists on a much more level plane to go straight into the bag, rather than arc up and down. The secret is learning to pass a fist from Front-to-back-to-Front, and then out to the side while keeping the elbow up close to the same position for the whole thing. In the RDP, your lead fist angles out to the side while the second fist connects in the RDP.

                      You can do it!
                      Speed Bag

                      Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
                      *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
                      The Quest Continues...
                      Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

                      THE 10th Year Reunion!

                      sigpic

                      The Art of the Bag

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks for the tips guys. First, Tim: I don't have the speed bag bible, but I have youtube. Everything I have learnt is from you, Alan and Skunk. Thanks for that. Second, Alan: Thanks for the tip on the elbows. I will try to keep my elbows up. Any other advice would be much appreciated. I am still learning and trying to improve.
                        -Dax

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          If you are bored with your workout

                          I was bored with my workout and was able to snap out of it after watching Alan Kahn's rehab speedbag video. I am a doctor, but not a rehab specialist. Alan's video motivated me to volunteer to teach kids at the Children's hospital in Seattle how to hit the bag. Many of the kids are in wheelchairs and partially paralyzed after accidents or illnesses. Alan is correct in believing that this is a great exercise for wheelchair athletes and for rehab. It gives hope to kids and their family. It is good for all kids, but it has been especially popular with teenage boys. It is amazing to watch kids go from being so weak that they cannot hit the bag hard enough to have it reach the backboard, to doing front fist rolls and outward elbow strikes. I have extended the volunteer work to include the local Y. I was able to raise money from friends, work, and family to put adjustable Balazs setups in both the Y and the hospital. Alan Kahn donated tons of stuff including DVDs, books, and autographed speedbags. The kids love the DVDS! This whole endeavor has re-motivated me tremendously to practice the bag. I want to thank Alan for his enthusiasic support of this endeavor. I never would have done this if I did not read his book and see his videos.

                          My advice if you are bored. Volunteer at your local Y or Children's hospital to teach the speedbag. It helped me get out of a rut.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Noticed you are using the everlast plastic B/H swivel. I have not long changed to one of those myself.

                            To be honest I find them quite dull, and admittedly I only went to it because I got a knock on the door from my neighbours (noise).

                            Yeah sure, by using the plastic B/H swivel I was able to cut the noise down, but by loosing that extra noise, our old friend 'the click', I must have lost about 30% inspiration.

                            At this point, as Tim says, I turn to something I want to get better at. Page 152 of SBB usually does it for me. After a session of that it usually brings me back to what I know I can do fluently, which makes me feel a whole lot better about it.

                            So, if noise isn't a problem for you, those all metal B/H swivels are much more entertaining in my opinion, and you will notice the difference. I believe the Watkins all metal B/H swivel are still readily available and if you persist you may also find an everlast model which I consider to be top of the range and the most sensitive.

                            A good range of different size bags also provides different options too.

                            Good luck.
                            sigpic'IRON HORSE, LIVE TO RIDE'

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by mikerehab View Post
                              I was bored with my workout and was able to snap out of it after watching Alan Kahn's rehab speedbag video. I am a doctor, but not a rehab specialist. Alan's video motivated me to volunteer to teach kids at the Children's hospital in Seattle how to hit the bag. Many of the kids are in wheelchairs and partially paralyzed after accidents or illnesses. Alan is correct in believing that this is a great exercise for wheelchair athletes and for rehab. It gives hope to kids and their family. It is good for all kids, but it has been especially popular with teenage boys. It is amazing to watch kids go from being so weak that they cannot hit the bag hard enough to have it reach the backboard, to doing front fist rolls and outward elbow strikes. I have extended the volunteer work to include the local Y. I was able to raise money from friends, work, and family to put adjustable Balazs setups in both the Y and the hospital. Alan Kahn donated tons of stuff including DVDs, books, and autographed speedbags. The kids love the DVDS! This whole endeavor has re-motivated me tremendously to practice the bag. I want to thank Alan for his enthusiasic support of this endeavor. I never would have done this if I did not read his book and see his videos.

                              My advice if you are bored. Volunteer at your local Y or Children's hospital to teach the speedbag. It helped me get out of a rut.
                              Hello Mike. Great to see you take the time to join us online. It should come as no surprise that the magic of the speed bag has attracted many of the brightest and most educated leaders from many fields of science, medicine, math, media, sports, military and martial arts. Your post is humbling and appreciated, but the main point is that YOU are the man under the board with those kids in Seattle. YOU are making the commitment through your vision, time and leadership to make that happen. My efforts to support you are surely secondary to YOU making it happen for those kids, and I truly thank YOU for that. YOUR dedication is allowing those many teens and their families to discover and learn the joys and benefits of using the speed bag.

                              Many of the board members here have heard about a few of the unique efforts underway using the speed bag. But let me share just a few private emails I receive ( cleansed to removed any personal identifying elements..) to let you see just how much the speed bag is doing for people. And please keep in mind, this IS about the bag and how it can transform lives in ways you never imagined:
                              ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
                              Dear Speedbagcentral.com

                              i am 65 and a former custom furniture builder, i have had cancer twice ,,vioce box and a spot on my right lung. been on your web site for about 2 yrs now. what i am doing is building speed bag platforms for breast cancer,patients, and for people with C.O.P.D. The speed bag will help them with upper body,and arms. Note: i am doing all this for free. I have a guy to help me install them. I am working with the James cancer Hosp. at Ohio State, What I need is some imput from you on this matter,and a copy of The Speed Bag Bible. I need it now ,but can only pay you about $10.00 per mo, on or about the 12th of each mo, until paid for.i only get about $736.00 a mo. from S.S. so i hope you can help. thanks
                              ++++++++++++++++++
                              Mr. Kahn,

                              Last year I aquired a speed bag/heavy bag platform from one of my friends. ....

                              It took about half an hour to google "speed bag" techniques and find your site. 18 hours later, i dragged my parents old recumbant exercise bike under the bag.

                              I feel compelled to thank you, as your videos have changed my life. My cardio is bagwork, and biking. For kicks, i add music. The limits of my equipment preclude me from hitting the same timing as you, but just before the platform vibrates out of control..i get kinda close. Kinda... The right songs and a little luck make me feel like im following in your footsteps. Most every other song makes me snarl, and try harder. You have a giant bulls eye on you, in my minds eye, so im gonna keep on banging till i catch your mojo. Then i'll keep banging on.

                              The cardio effect of the bike and the bag was instrumental in losing close to a hundred pounds i gained from injury, lethargy, and stress. I switched from coaching soccer to playing soccer in the most competetive league around (the hispanic league, a wild one). I ran several races last year, including a half marathon. A knee blowout kept me from the full marathon, but i have my eyes on one by the end of 2008. I am a Cuong Nhu instructor, and everything i do has improved from the inspiration you provided me. I fight like a hungry, crazy animal. While being overweight, i was more of a chessmaster, trying to save gas and not get pounded. Now, I chase some really well qualified blackbelts around the ring, i pound on them and push them into "save gas" mode.
                              .... the bag has transformed me from "boring" into "threatening." This is very cool.

                              Please accept my gratitude, and by all means, continue to do new and more awesome things with the bag.
                              +++++++++++++++++++++++++

                              Alan,

                              I just want to thank you for what your speed bag bible book and DVD has done for me. I am the father of a teenage age son who had reached that age where he wanted little to do with me. I tried to remain an influence in his life, but dispite my best, and probably overbearing efforts, we really grew apart. If fact we barely spoke and I feared he would move out or run away. We just could not communicate. A close friend of mine had a speed bag in his garage, and when I would go over to his place I noticed he was really getting good, hitting the bag from all around. He had your book and video, and started showing me. With little else to do, and a son that could have cared less, I put up a bag and board of my own, and started using your program. I got addicted to it, and every night I spent at least an hour practicing. If I say so myself, I got pretty d*mn good, hitting from the front and back and elbows. One night I turned around and noticed my son watching and with a look of admiration I swear I hadn't seen in years, he said "Wow Dad, that's really cool. Your really good at that.." That night, for the first time in years, we actually spent time together with me showing him some of the moves. We did that a few more times, and then he asked if his some of his friends could join in, because they might want to learn.
                              to make this short, over the next few months, myself, my son and his four friends ended up spending almost every night together in the garage working together on the speed bag. Suddenly I became the coolest dad around and my son is bragging about me and bringing his friends over to hang out and hit the bag. I think we've become really close and he confides in me about stuff now he wouldn't even have mentioned before the speed bag brought us together. Not only do I feel like his father, I really think we've become close friends. I still can't believe it.
                              So I justed wanted to thank you for taking the time to create your program. I hope it has done great things for you, but it has given me back my son, and for that I truly thank you. My phone number is ***** and if ever come to ***** please let me know.
                              ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

                              Dear Mr. Kahn

                              I am a C7 quadriplegic who was looking for home fitness activities. I do have decent shoulder and arm strength, but have hand weakness. Before my injury I used to do some boxing and punching but cannot make a tight fist now. I saw a demonstration video of you hitting the speed bag in a wheel chair and sitting on a cycle. That inspired me to get a cheapo wall unit and put it up in my apartment low enough for me to reach easily. Wow, was this a great exercise! I could really punch the speed bag OK because you don't need a tight fist and it definitely burns (in a good way) my shoulders and arms. I got your book from title boxing and now I'm working on elbow strikes and punching from behind the bag. I'm having trouble with Reverse Rolling, so any tips would be appreciated.
                              Thanks for including the rehab section in your book and showing the world that the speed bag is adaptable to those of us in wheelchairs. Its making a big difference in my life.
                              ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

                              I have many letters and emails like these above, and it's an unbelievable feeling. The morale of this story is: Don't ever underestimate the power of the speed bag and how YOU taking time to show others can change peoples lives. I want everyone to master the speed bag, but when you work on your own skills it only benefits you. When you show someone else, it changes the lives of others. So, when someone says, "how did you do that?.." Show them. Show them as many times as it takes. It might make a memory that lasts their entire lifetime.

                              thanks again Mike. And welcome to the Forum.
                              Speed Bag

                              Put a little Rhythm in YOUR workout!
                              *attendee: Every SB gathering so far!
                              The Quest Continues...
                              Onward to SpeedB.A.G. X! Summer 2019

                              THE 10th Year Reunion!

                              sigpic

                              The Art of the Bag

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